UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON
AT TACOMA
CHERYL LINDSEY SEELHOFF,
a married woman,
Plaintiff, Tacoma, Washington
vs.
PAT and SUE WELCH,
husband and wife,
Defendants.
Docket No. C97-5383FDB
Tacoma, Washington
September 8, 1998
Trial
Volume 6
TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS
BEFORE THE HONORABLE FRANKLIN D. BURGESS
UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGE, and a Jury.
APPEARANCES:
For the Plaintiff:
BARBARA J. DUFFY
GWENDOLYN PAYTON KLEIN
Lane Powell Spears Lubersky
1420 Fifth Avenue, Suite 4100
Seattle, Washington 98101-2338
For the Defendants:
RUDY R. LACHENMEIER
LORI DeDOBBELAERE
Lachenmeier, Enloe & Rall
9600 S.W. Capitol Highway
Portland, Oregon 97219
Court Reporter: Teri Hendrix
Union Station Courthouse, Room 3100
1717 Pacific Avenue
Tacoma, Washington 98402
(253) 593-6545
Proceedings recorded by mechanical stenography, transcript
produced by Reporter on computer.
Excerpt from transcripts Volume 6, September 8, 1998 Pages 1091-1317
How to use these documents.
A complete copy of the transcript are availble on an independent web site.
http://members.aol.com/Hsingcase/index.html
(Link provide by permission)
Documents can be ordered by writing to:
US District Court
Western District of Washington
P.O. Box 1935
Tacoma, Washington 98401
11461 conferences?
2 A. I believe I did hear the one in Chicago.
3 One of the problems of being the person putting on the
4 conference is that you are constantly called away to solve
5 problems. So it was hard for me to be able to sit through
6 anything entirely, but I did enjoy what I heard. She's a very
7 good speaker.
8 Q. And the one she spoke on was biblical and referenced Titus
9 2?
10 A. Yes, yes, and a very strong message related to Christian
11 motherhood and being a Christian wife.
12 Q. Let's get to the CHEO conference and exactly what happened
13 there.
14 I am going to ask you a question here. This is just a
15 preference so we know where we are going. I don't want you to
16 take off without a question.
17 A. All right.
18 Q. Were you contacted by Cheryl Lindsey's husband?
19 A. Yes.
20 Q. Can you tell us how that occurred? We are talking about
21 Claude?
22 A. Yes, Claude Lindsey.
23 Q. What happened?
24 A. I arrived in Columbus, Ohio to be one of the keynote
25 speakers at the Christian Home Education Organization for Ohio.
1147
1 When I arrived I was given a note that Claude Lindsey had
2 called from -- well, I didn't know where at first, but I found
3 out when I returned the call that he was in New Orleans, and he
4 wanted to know if I would do him a favor.
5 Q. Specifically what did he ask you to do?
6 A. He told me that Cheryl and he were separated, that they were
7 having a problem in their marriage. That she had
8 MS. DUFFY: Objection, Your Honor.
9 THE COURT: Haven't we already covered this, counsel?
10 Is this new?
11 MR. LACHENMEIER: Well -
12 THE COURT: No. I am talking to Ms. Duffy.
13 Is there something here we haven't heard before?
14 MS. DUFFY: Well, no. And it, s also hearsay.
15 THE COURT: Go ahead, answer the question.
16 A. He told me that his wife had had an affair, that he had
17 caught her with another man. And that she had repented of that
18 and that the church was trying to help them restore their
19 marriage, referring to the church here in Washington State.
20 And he wanted to know if I would be willing to keep my eyes
21 open. He was afraid that she might be having a rendezvous with
22 this man during the CHEO conference in Columbus.
23 So this kind of blew me away because I am here, she's the
24 other keynote speaker for the conference.
25 I told him I couldn't just go on this without any
1148
1 verification. So I asked for the name and phone number of his
2 pastor in Washington so that I could call and get some kind of
3 reality check on all of this.
4 BY MR. LACHENMEIER:
5 Q. Did you do so?
6 A. Yes, I did.
7 Q. What were you told?
8 A. They said that Claude's account was accurate. That Cheryl
9 had had an affair, that she had repented. And that she was -
10 basically this was her first, I think, trip after that whole
11 process.
12 Q. At that point what was your hope and prayers for the
13 situation?
14 A. Well, my concern was to be able to give a good report, to
15 say I see nothing going on and, in fact, I didn't. I didn't see
16 her with anyone that could have been this other man.
17 So I agreed to keep my eyes open and if I saw anything that
18 looked suspicious that I would contact them and let them know.
19 Q. Did you make an attempt or arrange to talk to the plaintiff
20 to see whether she would volunteer any of this information?
21 A. Yes. I asked her if she'd like to get together for
22 breakfast the following morning, and she agreed.
23 Because she was also scheduled at that time to speak for me
24 in one of my conferences in Atlanta, we had a relationship that
25 I could ask her if she could get together, and so we did.
1149
1 And my hope was that she would open up and share with me
2 what was going on and that I could speak freely with her about
3 my concern for her family.
4 Q. How did you try to get her to open up?
5 A. Well, I told her that I had been in the home school circuit
6 for some time and that it could be very wearing on your family
7 life and that it was important to keep your perspective on
8 things and not to take chances with your family just in order to
9 maintain your presence in the home school limelight.
10 Q. Her response?
11 A. She asked, why are you telling me this? And I just told
12 her, I don't know. I just wanted to make sure she didn't get
13 hurt.
14 Q. At this point were you aware of any allegations from anyone
15 about abuse by Claude?
16 A. No, I wasn't.
17 Q. Would it have made any difference?
18 A. Well, not really, because having been a pastor, having been
19 trained and having had some five years experience in the
20 pastorate, nothing surprises me about domestic situations.
21 There's usually two sides to every conflict.
22 Q. It's sometimes easier to put together relationships when
23 there's problems on both sides?
24 MS. DUFFY: Objection, Your Honor, objection to the
25 relevance.