UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA

CHERYL LINDSEY SEELHOFF, a married woman, Plaintiff, Tacoma, Washington vs. PAT and SUE WELCH, husband and wife, Defendants.

Docket No. C97-5383FDB Tacoma, Washington September 2, 1998 Trial Volume 3

TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS BEFORE THE HONORABLE FRANKLIN D. BURGESS UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGE, and a Jury.

APPEARANCES: For the Plaintiff:	BARBARA J. DUFFY GWENDOLYN PAYTON KLEIN Lane Powell Spears Lubersky 1420 Fifth Avenue, Suite 4100 Seattle, Washington 98101-2338
For the Defendants:	RUDY R. LACHENMEIER LORI DeDOBBELAERE Lachenmeier, Enloe & Rall 9600 S.W. Capitol Highway Portland, Oregon 97219
Court Reporter:	Teri Hendrix Union Station Courthouse, Room 3100 1717 Pacific Avenue Tacoma, Washington 98402 (253) 593-6545

Proceedings recorded by mechanical stenography, transcript produced by Reporter on computer.

Excerpt from transcripts Volume 3 September 2, 1998 Pages 446-683


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P.O. Box 1935
Tacoma, Washington 98401

537

1  Q.  Do you recall how you got Cheryl's private number?
2  A.  I do not remember.
3  Q.  The next entry, what is that?
4  A.  "Called parents number, 12 rings, no answer."
5  Q.  Why is it you called Cheryl's parents?
6  A.  I can't recall at this point why I did, other than to track
7  Cheryl down.
8  Q.  If you were to look on the inside flap of your Cheryl
9  Lindsey folder, would you find her parents, phone number there?
10  A.  I believe so.
11  Q.  You would probably find her private number there, as well?
12  A.  As I indicated in my prior testimony, I believe there was at
13  least two numbers I had for Cheryl.
14  Q.  One of which you understood to be her private number?
15  A.  Yes, I did.
16  Q.  What's the next?
17  A.  "LMTC, left message to call on Gentle Spirit magazine
18  machine.,,
19  Q.  What's the next?
20  A.  "Called Cheryl's private number, 10 rings, no answer."
21  Q.  What's the next entry?
22  A.  10:15 to 10:25, "called Jonathan Lindvall, Irene Williams
23  and Roland to advise no call. Roland spoke with Jennifer 30
24  minutes ago and knew they were home. Told me to call Gentle
25  Spirit number and while message going push 30 on touch phone."

538

1  Q.  Okay. What's the next entry say?
2  A.  10:28, again, I presume, p.m., "called and did 3 and 0.
3  Child answered. Told mother it was me. Cheryl said she would
4  call me back in 10 minutes."
5  Q.  Okay. And I take it she didn't call you back; Cheryl
6  Lindsey?
7  A.  That is correct.
8  Q.  What's the next entry?
9  A.  11:25 p.m., "Call from Cheryl's mom. Did not go well (see
10  separate notes) removed myself from situation.
11  Q.  Okay. And the next note there?
12  A.  11:40 to 12:05, "advised Roland, Jonathan, Claude, and
13  Pastor Joe of decision to remove ourselves and turn over to
14  Satan (1st Corinthians 5, 1st Timothy 1:20."
15  Q.  I want to go through a couple of things. I want to finish
16  our review of the last page of Exhibit 112, the last page, I
17  think you've already identified is a note of a conversation that
18  you had with Phyllis Hansler, Cheryl Lindsey's mother. Would
19  you do me a favor and just read that?
20  A.  "Received call from Cheryl's mother. Became very irate with
21  me. I had Carol on the other line. Accused me of trying to
22  ruin Cheryl's life. Went on and on. (Discussion did not go
23  well). I ended up getting off phone. It says "of" but the
24  intent there was "off," "and Carol spoke with her for short
25  while. In short, Cheryl will not cooperate any more.Wants me

539

1  to 'leave her alone,".
2  Q.  And the "leave her alone" you put in quotes?
3  A.  Yes.
4  Q.  I noticed -- and by the way, have we now gone through all
5  the notes of conversations that you're aware of that you had
6  regarding Cheryl Lindsey?
7  A.  To the best of my knowledge, yes, we have.
8  Q.  I'm trying to understand how did you put these notes
9  together. How is it you included a parenthetical that said you
10  had a separate note for this conversation if, like you told me,
11  you were taking the notes as the conversation was occurring?
12  A.  When I'm taking notes in most of these cases, if not all --
13  I would have to go back and look -- if I am not initiating the
14  call, I'm receiving a call that I expected.
15  In other words, I'm working this matter or working with this
16  situation and have a pad there. When it came down to the call
17  from Cheryl's mom, I'm at the bottom of the page and for
18  whatever reason, I chose to write it up separately.
19  I remember the discussion started in a very difficult tone
20  with Cheryl's mother. And I was not taking notes as we were
21  speaking; I was pretty much in an attempt to somewhat defend
22  myself because of Cheryl's mother's irateness.
23  Q.  It appears from your notes, sometime after your conversation
24  with Cheryl's mother, that's the time you elected to remove
25  yourself from the situation. Is that a fair statement?

540

1  A.  That would be a fair statement, yes, ma'am.
2  Q.  Why is it you after that conversation with Cheryl Lindsey's
3  mother you decided to remove yourself from the situation?
4  A.  Obviously, her mother told me to leave her alone. It was
5  becoming more and more evident after two calls from Roland and
6  now that Cheryl did not call me and her mother called, Cheryl
7  had changed her mind, was not willing to move toward a
8  restoration, did not want to go to counseling with Jim Logan.
9    My purpose was for restoration of the family. As I
10  contended with Cheryl and her mother, there was nothing in my
11  opinion left to do. I was not in a position to counsel with
12  them, that's why I was recommending Jim Logan. I was simply in
13  a position to try to lead them in that capacity and make a
14  decision or recommendation to the Board of Directors what to do
15  with her tapes.
16    And my removal of the involvement with Cheryl, I determined
17  from that point, there was no reason to call her, attempt to
18  call her or anyone related to this matter.
19  Q.  Did you ever talk to Gregg Harris about this topic of Cheryl
20  Lindsey and her relationship with Rick Seelhoff?
21  A.  I do not recall ever speaking with Gregg Harris about this
22  matter. I believe if I had, I would have documented it. I do
23  not recall ever speaking with him about this matter.
24  Q.  You mentioned that your wife subscribed to Gentle Spirit and
25  you believe that you folks received copies of Sue Welch's