UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT WESTERN DISTRICT OF WASHINGTON AT TACOMA

CHERYL LINDSEY SEELHOFF, a married woman, Plaintiff, Tacoma, Washington vs. PAT and SUE WELCH, husband and wife, Defendants.

Docket No. C97-5383FDB Tacoma, Washington September 2, 1998 Trial Volume 3

TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS BEFORE THE HONORABLE FRANKLIN D. BURGESS UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGE, and a Jury.

APPEARANCES: For the Plaintiff:	BARBARA J. DUFFY GWENDOLYN PAYTON KLEIN Lane Powell Spears Lubersky 1420 Fifth Avenue, Suite 4100 Seattle, Washington 98101-2338
For the Defendants:	RUDY R. LACHENMEIER LORI DeDOBBELAERE Lachenmeier, Enloe & Rall 9600 S.W. Capitol Highway Portland, Oregon 97219
Court Reporter:	Teri Hendrix Union Station Courthouse, Room 3100 1717 Pacific Avenue Tacoma, Washington 98402 (253) 593-6545

Proceedings recorded by mechanical stenography, transcript produced by Reporter on computer.

Excerpt from transcripts Volume 3 September 2, 1998 Pages 446-683


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Tacoma, Washington 98401

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1  Q.  There was considerable discussion about this issue and
2  Cheryl Lindsey, so let's cut right to that.
3    Did you ever have any discussions about Cheryl Lindsey and
4  the make-up of her marriage?
5  A.  Discussions with Cheryl?
6  Q.  Yes.
7  A.  Yes.
8  Q.  How did it come about?
9  A.  We had received a complaint from a state leader that had
10  felt -- they had felt deceived because they did not know about
11  Cheryl's marriage. So we were since the complaint came to
12  us, and being somewhat responsible for recommending speakers is
13  the connection there, we talked to her about it.
14  Q.  And obviously, she got upset, and there was an exchange of
15  letters; right?
16  A.  Yes.
17      MS. DUFFY: Object to the form.
18      THE COURT: The answer is there.
19      MR. LACHENMEIER: I am just trying to move this along.
20  BY MR. LACHENMEIER:
21  Q.   What was the conclusion of the conversations with Cheryl
22  Lindsey?
23  A.   At one point, I was telling Cheryl that I felt that -- I had
24  absolutely no problem with an interracial marriage, but that I
25  was passing along to her the response of people who sponsored

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1  her in to speak, not to the general public, but people that
2  sponsored her in to speak may have a right to know that because
3  some of them had expressed surprise and a feeling of deceit.
4  And it made me feel like she was trying to keep it a secret.
5  And that she shouldn't kind of hide her husband away, that it
6  should -- it was nothing to be ashamed of, she should make it
7  public.
8  And she said that she and her husband had discussed just
9  that issue, and at that time they felt it would hurt her
10  ministry to make that fact known, but they were open to
11  gradually making it known to her readers.
12  Q.  So she told you that they purposefully were not making it
13  known?
14  A.  That's what I understood, yes.
15  Q.  And you've received lots of Gentle Spirit magazines; right?
16  A.  Yes.
17  Q.  In any of them, was her husband pictured, that you recall?
18  A.  Not that I recall.
19  Q.  Her family was shown; right?
20  A.  After our discussion, there was some pictures of her
21  children, but they were not identified as her children.
22  Q.  Okay. Did you go to some great trouble to straighten out
23  this issue that there was some rumors from Jones University?
24  A.  Yes. Cheryl had told me that she was very hurt, and I don't
25  blame her for being very hurt, from the letters that she had